They both believe in determinism—no freewill! The only difference is that atheists believe in determinism caused by random evolutionary processes; whereas Calvinists believe in determinism brought about by the unalterable decrees of God. But the end result is the same—no human freewill! I came across the above short discussion between Alex O’Connor (atheist), advocating determinism; and Ben Shapiro (Orthodox Jew), supporting freewill.
The problem with such debates is that the freewill advocates, like Ben Shapiro, are at a disadvantage in defending their theological position, because they don’t have enough revealed knowledge about the facts of creation (as Ben Shapiro later admits) to be able to successfully do so (and Latter-day Saints do!).
If you start from the atheist perspective (that everything is determined by random evolutionary processes), they have a valid point—there can be no freewill. But then on the other hand, if you start with the Calvinist theological position (that God made everything out of nothing), there can be no freewill either—because how man acts or behaves will in the end depend on how God created or manufactured him (out of nothing). If God made man out of nothing, then determinism is the only logical conclusion.
Latter-day Saints are lucky, they have additional knowledge revealed to them that others don’t have. Modern LDS revelation informs us that the intelligent part of man was not created, but has always existed:
Doctrine and Covenants 93:
29 Man was also in the beginning with God. Intelligence, or the light of truth, was not created or made, neither indeed can be.
30 All truth is independent in that sphere in which God has placed it, to act for itself, as all intelligence also; otherwise there is no existence.
The precise nature of that “Intelligence,” or “light of truth,” which was “not created or made,” has not been revealed; and in the past there has been some unjustified speculation about it among Latter–day Saints. But putting aside the speculations, there is the obvious assertion that the “intelligent component” of human existence (whatever that is), is not created, but has always existed. That solves the problem of moral agency, accountability, and human freewill, from an LDS theological perspective. Ben Shapiro does a good job of defending the doctrine of human freewill from a deistic point of view—by appealing to a lack of sufficient revealed information on the subject. The following exchange between Ben and Alex takes place right at the end of the video, starting at 10:18 minutes (emphasis added):
Ben:
“But now you are falling into the same sort of argument that I excluded at the beginning, which was, I said that the beauty of religion is that there is a bunch of stuff I don’t understand; so I can’t explain to you how the uncaused self makes decisions.”
Alex:
“Well then, I can’t explain to you how the uncaused self exists in an atheist environment.”
Ben:
“You have a burden and I don’t, meaning that … I mean the simple fact is that you are the one who is claiming that a reasonable materialist universe is the cause of all; and so if that is the case, you do have to explain the mechanism in a way that I certainly do not. My entire philosophy rests on the positing of an entire realm of things I don’t understand, in terms of their interaction with the world. Now as I said at the very beginning, that leaves me a giant escape hatch; I am not going to pretend that that is not a giant escape hatch; it acts in practice as a giant escape hatch.”
Like I said, he does a good job of defending his theological position, in the absence of sufficient information on the subject; but the additional insight into the subject provided in LDS revelation, as outlined above, would enable him to do an even more effective job in defending that theological position. Ben Shapiro then concludes his remarks as follows:
Ben:
“It also tends to act as a fundamental principle of faith, right; again, in every moral realm, right; when we get to the problem of good and evil, right—one of the big questions is, Well, how can God allow evil to take place in the world; and the fundamental religious answer, as it has been for thousands of years is, my mind is not God’s, which is a giant escape hatch. It also happens to be true from a religious point of view.”
Well, I have good news for him. There is a perfectly good, adequate, convincing, biblical explanation for the presence of evil in the world. The answer is given in the following verses (among others):
John 5:
28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,
29 And shall come forth; they that have done good, unto the resurrection of life; and they that have done evil, unto the resurrection of damnation.
Acts 17:
31 Because he hath appointed a day, in the which he will judge the world in righteousness by that man whom he hath ordained; whereof he hath given assurance unto all men, in that he hath raised him from the dead.
Colossians 3:
25 But he that doeth wrong shall receive for the wrong which he hath done: and there is no respect of persons.
1 Peter 1:
17 And if ye call on the Father, who without respect of persons judgeth according to every man’s work, pass the time of your sojourning here in fear:
Revelation 20:
12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works.
13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works.
The Bible makes it clear that the purpose of this (brief) period of mortality is to test mankind to see who will do good and who will do evil, so that they can then be judged for their actions in this life (good or bad), and be rewarded or punished accordingly. How could God judge mankind for the good or evil that they have done in this life, if they were not free to do good or evil? Modern LDS scripture adds another interesting insight to that:
Doctrine and Covenants 29:
39 And it must needs be that the devil should tempt the children of men, or they could not be agents unto themselves; for if they never should have bitter they could not know the sweet.
Without the temptations of the devil, mankind would not be able to choose between good and evil. God wants mankind to be able to (freely) choose between good and evil, so that they can be judged, and the judgment that God will bring upon them will be just—hence the need for the temptations of the devil. God by his Spirit persuades them to do good (John 1:9; Romans 2:6-16), while the devil by his evil spirit persuades them to do evil. There will be no more temptations of the devil in heaven—or even during the Millennium, for the most part (Rev. 20:1-3).
Another important consideration that that question does not take into account is that this present state of the world that we are now experiencing is very short, compared to the rest of eternity. It is not something that is going to continue forever. Once this (brief) testing period is over, we will enter into an eternal state where we will each receive the just consequences of our actions in this life; and where the present state of affairs no longer continues.
Evil must necessarily exist in this brief period of mortality, so that mankind can then be judged for the good or evil that they have done, and the judgment that God will bring upon them on judgment day will be just. The good news is that it won’t last very long. This brief period of mortality is a nanosecond compared to the rest of eternity—but it determines for us how the rest of that eternity will be spent.
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